The ISFP type presents some strange dichotomies. On the one hand they are retiring, shy, peaceful, and on the other, they seem to be some of the biggest bullies around. It is almost like they hold the prospect of ENTJ inside themselves as well as their own type, the pussy type. Tough pussies.
Some of the most dick-suckable men lie at this type, the men that are just so attractive and pretty, yet masculine. Pretty boys. And they are somehow sensitive to women, know just what women want and yet are not pansies or wimps either. They can be like that type of sensitive stud guy that a women goes gaga over.
They can be mouthy and challenging or just totally quiet and retiring. Choleric or phlegmatic. And of course sanguine too as their general SP backdrop suggests.
An ISFP can be very athletic and dedicated to a sport or craft or total and utter losers, dropouts and stoners. Like all those rock rebels. Or they can be on the other side of the high school fence and be the bullying jocks who fuck with the weaker less athletic and dorky kids.
They can be utterly cool or be pretty unhip and kind of ISTJish uncool. George Harrison comes to mind. They can be weird and very subjective. They seem to form a very subjective picture of the world and themselves.
ISFPs all tend to respond to heaviness and harshness. They can take a lot of it, whether they are dispensing it or they are on the receiving end of it. They’re very resilient and tough. They can be the members of a rock group that kind of function like glue, keeping it together in a quiet and smoldering way. They are like a smoldering flame. Many of them have little apparent ego. They just go on doing their thing and they usually have some one thing that they are good at such as playing guitar really well, a craft of some sort.
Or they are just drifters and marginal people. It depends on whether they activate their auxiliary Se in a positive way. These ISFPs have the ability to work hard, are responsible, and will just quietly and with a total lack of ego, go on in the name of some cause or deep flame type thing. There is something about love in this type, a true and deep love for some thing. Dedication to a craft, like all those great and persevering guitar players: Clapton, Hendrix, Harrison, Richards, Slash. Little ego and just a dedication to their craft and a deep and abiding love for it that eclipses all else.
It seems they can be jerks when their ISTJ id is running the show. Maybe this is where they can be bullies and judgmental of all the fuckups.
They can simultaneously be very moral, overly so, and then not care a fuck about some ENTJ bully being rough with others and them. They tend to respond and be receptive to tyrants. Maybe they need it because they have a phlegmatic aspect to them and they can’t get things going on their own too successfully. It’s like they need other people, a group, a clan, and they become very attached to their inherited clan. Like an absolute dedication to it.
In the rock world, many of them will actually eschew fame and popularity for sincerity in what they were doing in the first place. They will be the ones to leave, drop out when things get too circus-like. Examples: Izzy Stradlin of Guns N Roses comes to mind. The first bassist for for the band Tool maybe. He’s the one who wrote that really cool bass riff for the song Sober.
Many ISFPs are dropouts from things. They quit the system or group when it becomes too perverted and distorted from its pure beginnings. They just won’t have any part of it.
However, sometimes they are the very ones who will be used as tools for a group concern. I’m thinking of Gilby Clarke replacing Izzy in Guns N Roses. Trade one ISFP for another. And they will allow themselves to be used in a sense for a time. The smothered and the smotherer it seems is their lot. They can take a lot of abuse but watch out when they swing in the other direction. They will dish it out harshly too. Probaly a bunch of great facesitters these ones are.
Pacifists, masochists, victims of the system and yet perpetuators of its goals and values. Maybe that is the thing about Fi. It is indiscriminate in the values it dispenses. Or perpetuates. It will do whatever its beloved clan wants, the ones it is dependent on, whoever that group is. So, it probably depends on the group and values they inherit.
And then it seems some of them can be total rebels against their clan and side with the poor and unfortunate above all else. And they really mean it. Not like an ENFP or something in hoorah to a great appearance of mercy.
ISFP guys can be very sexy, smoldering, and come-hither. And very open to other’s energies kind of nodding with you, saying “yes uh-huh” but then not honoring anything deep. They are unlike INFPs in this respect who are much more genuinely open to everyone. Ne vs. Se. ISFPs size you up. They fuck with you, poke you, see what you are made of. In private one-on-one with them they might be very intimate and leading on, but then watch how their tune may change when they get in a group with their other buddies. They might make fun of you. Make digs at you. They don’t like clinginess. It’s like they are clingy but ashamed of it, at least the men. And it’s because of this dichotomy of femininity and masculinity in the type. They want to be cool and unaffected and like “Yeah, whatever, I could take it or leave it”. And they can in action. They present a dichotomy (trichotomy?) between a lover, a leaver, and a clinger.
As lovers they trump all other types. The men at least. They will do all those nasty things that a women wants. They understand women psychology. They understand desire. Forbidden fruits. They will go rogue. But, when they get back to their comrades, don’t expect them to acknowledge it. That was between you and them. And there is something of the traitor in the ISFP. Something mutinous and undependable. Like a weakness. They are both very strong and very weak. An ISFP can be absolutely weak, pathetic, and cowardly and yet watch out for their stings. Yes, there is something totally unbeholden here. They can have utter passion and desire and love and reciprocation. When you are with one of them in intimate circumstances, they can make you feel so special and you can adore them. But, then it can all dry up or change somehow and they will be gone – emotionally and physically. The classic slipping away lover. Without a word or explanation. Well, did they ever really say anything about promises? ISFPs insinuate, infer, but rarely state outright. They just make you feel a certain way. But, if they decide they have some reason for leaving (more like an impulse) or you repulsed them in some way. If you were uncool around them, they gone. Very shallow in a way.
They kind of see themselves ultimately as some rogue that only belongs to themselves at the end of the day. They are not whiny about their ideals being broken like some NF type. They are just hard in a way. And yet very soft and weak.
I think the astrology of an ISFP might be more important than usual because of this utter impressionability I am alluding to. Also, their inherited values, morals, clan, coming from their family. ISFPs seems like the classic violated-becoming-violator depending on how they were treated (imprinted) from the beginning. Because of their ISTJ id, they are very receptive to the correct and not correct ways of behaving, doing things etc. But since they are not particularly introspective they will just ingrain those mores and preserve and perpetuate them in some way.
However, there are breaking points for ISFPs in their lives. Points in their lives where they might reach where they do start to question all the shit they received. This is probably their Ni tertiary becoming active. It seems like they can live fully in a role or character and then just totally drop out from it. It’s like they are very receptive to the system but then they can become rebels and derelicts and tardy. It’s like “fuck it, let’s rock”.
This is them doing that opposite thing of totally not belonging to a clan and effectively wandering and roving around in nature or something, just totally turned off from society and all its etiquettes and even the etiquettes of their chosen clan. They just go mutinous. And it seems here they are very strong in a way, stronger than any other type – they are just beholden to…not a vision…well, a slight vision…but more just the principle of not belonging to anyone. One’s life being their own. We are in this circle of life and they can carry on from it in a way that is very admirable. Like being sly stoners on the outskirts of town. Not participating in karmic debts or gains anymore, realizing that all of life is just natural and amoral in the sense of man’s created and interpreted laws. Hard to bullshit or fool these ones. They are very grounded and persistent…and practical.
They can go homeless, set up a tent somewhere, and live very marginally. But, still be like mini-philosophers, stoner philosophers that have departed from the collective. And from there they can see it better. True, some of these ones can be very angry and carry on as silent agitators, but they aren’t pussies. They live by their code. Which is very idiosyncratic and they earned by the sweat of their brow. The thing about ISFPs they ain’t no natural intellectuals or ideologists. It wasn’t like they were born with a silver spoon in their mouth. They are natural workers. And they can work very hard when they are on the clock, as a natural instinct. But, when they off, they want to be left alone, to wander through their reveries. They want to get stoned and check out the world of nature and philosophy, like little children in this world. It’s all so new to them. How could they be jaded? How could they feel like they have seen it all, heard it all? The ISFP doesn’t feel like that.
Not an NF type. The ISFP doesn’t build up emotional systems. Ideal emotions. Ideal relationships. The Ideal is not something they know anything about. They don’t get all jumpy and frantic over “My relationship is not living up to my ideal”. Or “I’m not living up to my dreams and my visions.” ISFPs don’t start out like this. They have no dreams which they must live up to. They are more open to experience than an INFJ, for example. The ISFP doesn’t really care if they are understood or misunderstood. They don’t really care that much about who they are or their true place in the world. Not ambitious that way. They just kind of work with their presented experience. They don’t see that it could be any better or worse than what it was. It just is. Or was. It happened.
Why are you living here in this tent?
“It’s just where I decided I need to be. It feels right. It’s where I’m at now.”
Case closed.
Perfect. My husband is an isfp… and…well… you got everything exactly right. Creepy.
This sounds too much like my husband, even the guitar. Well, he’s an ISFP and I’m an INFJ.
Jelena- we should get together. Both INFJ’s married to ISFP’s leaving similar comments at similar times. Again… creepy. Are you also a Gemini?? 🙂
I’m a Virgo and he’s a Libra ☺
I had to post this video, because i believe it shows perfectly what you are talking about:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KyK0y02HvVc
Yes, it does.
lol
My aunt is an isfp. I feel drained emotionally after spending time with her. When we keep things light, shallow and surface level it’s perfect. Like, Hi how are you? You are looking dangerous, so are you…big laugh…like flames dancing around each other. But after that, the Te thinking pops in from nowhere. Comparing, comparing, plus another good mix of comparing and judging, not to mention the sly digs. She judges my spending habits, extravagance, compares her bargain hunts to the full price I paid. Like who gives a shit! We die eventually and so what you paid 1 cent and I paid 2. Same difference! We are a team, by my perspective, and then she disowns me behind my back. Integrity, know that word maybe! Am so over the emotional drain I feel around her. My qns is? Am I right to close the book on a close relationship and keep my distance for my own emotional sanity/emotional stability/health? Is this unrealistic or too idealistic of me? Because am beginning to value emotional happiness/health above all things. What is your take on this? Thank you.
Hey I think I might also be projecting my money spending insecurities/insensibilities on her…but the emotional drain that takes days to recover from? Is that acceptable?
😊that’s all. Thanks
No, it’s not acceptable. I think you should murder her and bury her in a shoebox.
🙂
Lol!!
Am working on it
Right this very min!
Rachel, I just cannot get over the way you describe your relationships with the female authority figures in your life. They ring SO close to home! Being raised as the youngest(and only) daughter of an ISFJ mother has played such an integral role in my journey through comprehending this MBTI maze. Growing up with her as an INFJ, I totally feel you as far as how they can be relentlessly judgmental of our orientation with Fe. I never met my grandmother, but from how my mother describes her and from everything I have read, she was an ISFP. She raised my mother as a single parent–which explains A LOT–and for a while I suspected my mother might be an ISFP as well, but I realize that it’s more the influence from being so intricately monitored by an ISFP as someone with the J preference that dictates the way she raised me. The NF really puts a wrench in things for the SF. They don’t know what to do with us lol. My mom just visited me here in NY a couple days ago and brought me clothes. Of course, these are clothes that she likes for me, not clothes that she feels I would like, because what is intuition again? Oh right, that thing where you consider that something else beyond what you see is appropriate could be possible and right as opposed to what you have decided is right because you already know everything. And she wonders why I hate inviting her over. I actually didn’t invite her! Ha! She totally pulled a guilt trip. “If you can’t visit home can you at least send me a picture?” Like okay, I get it, I’m a terrible daughter, you win. *fast forward two weeks* “I’m coming to visit.” *facepalm*
Hi Alexandria,
Long time, no see! Missed you! Lol let me tell you I am so grateful for Myers Briggs and Stellar Maze and the such for being able to understand finally who I am and who they are. And why even if anyone screams weirdo at me, I will be like ha so what! Get over it and keep yourself moving. I feel free. Like I don’t have to live chained in anyone’s dungeon/basement malnourished being force fed their ideas of what’s right or wrong. We will be fine either with or without your “pleasant” company. Our whole lives we have been mf*ckging drowning in their ideas of what’s right, what’s wrong can’t breath can’t do nothing…I can breath now. I dare anyone to say weirdo in my presence now, to anyone as a matter of fact. Next time we will send them the picture and sign our names with love hearts all over it…like Paris Hilton would, and say this is all the love you are getting from us today…have a nice day! Ya, we will have officially joined the crazy train. Lol!
Ha! Totally 🙂 My middle name(Kathleen) comes from her. I’m basically a junior. My first name is my mother’s middle name. Blake says that ISFP is the INFJ Id, and that just helps explain so much regarding why my mother always tells me how much I remind her of my grandmother. I really wish I could have met her. She passed when my mother was pregnant with me–she actually found out she was pregnant with me a month after my granny passed(and she was on birth control!! Yes, call me .1%), which is why I became junior–but I’d love to pick her brain. She was so beautiful and from stories I’m told, so nutty and funny and a total bitch lol. A bitch in the way that she took care of business and couldn’t get in her way for anything. I have never tested as a sensor but I can identify with ISFP and the Id explains so much. Even though I never got to know her, it helps me connect with my grandmother a lot more now and when people say I remind them of her, I feel a new kinship.
My mother is still crazy though. Because ISFJs are out of their fucking minds. INFJ, we’re doing alright 🙂
“Call me .1%” lol no we won’t. Lol that kills me! Ya u would have loved her plus she would have probably been a buffer btwn you and your mum like all grannies are. My aunt she’s got the I-will-make-this-sh*t-happen-you-just-watch-me market corned. Totally admire that about her. Plus we have a lot of in the moment chemistry between us…don’t know if one can say that about their aunt but I just did. Well here’s to Kathleen!
Yay!! Kathleen, I really feel would be proud of me for emarking on this journey. I love my mother so much, but she can be so mean!! I know my grandmother would default to just being nice because I would be her sole granddaughter! I miss this person I’ve never even met or seen. I just know we would get along. We would understand each other because of the the ISFP Id/INFJ Ego. We would just know each other. My mother always pointed out the negatives when saying how I remind her of my granny, too. That’s rude, isn’t it? Wouldn’t you want to give me a positive orientation to the world, especially if you’re naming me after yourself and granny? I guess not if you’re an ISFJ, because you people are crazy!!!! Good lord. Thankfully I always had music.
I seek solace in the fact that Kathleen would have lost her mind if she saw this madness lol. I just know she would. I miss her every day even though I never knew her. I know that as an ISFP she would have seen right through me and been so kind, and you’re right Rachel, a total buffer between my mother and I. Sometimes, I think my mother is slightly relieved that Kathleen is gone because she knows that I would have a defender and she would have to explain how she treats our relationship. Kathleen wouldn’t let her sleep at night haha. I feel proud to be told I’m like her. I miss her every day.
Hey girl! Am aching for you right now. We need to have a sit down with this our people. You do mine and I will do yours. We will say, look we have your number. We love you, but you need to back the f*ck out. Enough is enough. If you can’t walk around the secret garden carefully you get no invite next time. You hear? No trampling on the flowers, no walking all over the grass etc. this is the place where our thirst for life lives and you are killing it! Does that look macho enough, you think? We need to be badass like that guy from The Sopranos. No like all them badasses from The Sopranos and be like enough of this sh*t, we have come to demand respect. Girl, hang in there you got this!
Could you explain the istj id function you wrote about? How does it work and why is istj the id function here? My hubby tested as istj first a while ago, then he tested as isfp today. I thought it was weird because they seem like very different types, but it might make sense if there’s shadow relationship between the two. Maybe he wasn’t in a good place when he took that test the first time. He used to be a guitarist too btw.
I can really explain the ISTJ id function in a comment. I’d have to write an article about it. I’d first have to explain what the id function is for any type and then how it could be determined for any particular type. Basically, you take the same function that is in the auxiliary and change its direction from extraverted to introverted or introverted to extraverted. So, for ISFP you would be changing their extraverted sensation auxiliary to introverted sensation. So, that is the dominant function of the id type of ISFP. To figure out if it is an ISTJ or ISFJ type, simply take the inferior function of the type under consideration (ISFP in this case) and make it the auxiliary function for that id type. So, the inferior function of ISFP is extraverted thinking. So, that is the auxiliary function of the ISFP id type, which is ISTJ.
I know I haven’t explained much about the rationale for this here, or much of anywhere on this site, but that’s because…
well, just take a look at this for a clearer explanation.
Blake YOU are BRILLIANT!! My husband tested ISTJ but I always thought he was an ISFP. Everything you wrote is absolutely true. He is like 3 people in 1. He can be the meanest person I’ve ever seen, he can be COMPLETELY dependent or he can be absent. The ISTJ id explains soooo much. Thank you for writing this. I feel validated. I really want to run out into the world and scream this is who I really live with, not this person you think he is. Thank you!!
O well then! Top of the morning to you. And good evening. La di da.
Hi, Blake!
I’m also curious about the ISTJ id of the ISFP. This is interesting because, following the pattern, ISFP is the id of the INFJ.
According to Socionics, this is the relation of benefit. In this case, ISFP > INFJ (ISFPs are the benefactors) and ISTJ > ISFP (ISTJ benefactors). I’m assuming we can match the types of both systems by inverting the last letters for the introverts, which in my opinion seems to be pretty accurate.
Yes, all that is correct. I’m not going speak at length about the ISTJ id of ISFP here. I will likely write more about it in the fullness of time. Until then, let your imagination be impregnated with the implications of all that. Wonder at it. If it feels right, go with it. If it doesn’t, then don’t worry about it.
I think there is something to it. I don’t know exactly why. It’s just something I think I can see. And I say what I see. That’s about the size of it. But it pretty big by my calculations.
Reminds me of shoe designer to the stars, Christian Louboutin affiliating with all those royals. As an ISFP he detects the kindred money making spirit in them. Powerful people are useful allies and sometimes make good customers too I suppose. Plato knew all this.
Hey Blake, thank you very much for digging the ISFP. As an INFJ, I was surrounded by them all my life, and my conclusions towards this type are very similar to yours: they really depend upon their background and their group/thing they are into, which is a shame, because they’re all full of pontential and are often trapped in completely unhealthy settings, feeling inadequate, with low self-esteem and very suspicious about their artistic or athletic capacities. Plus, I think some of them can be very tortured people, overly sensitive to accept criticism and, yet, needing some kind of guidance. One of my best mates is an ISFP and falls into the loser pattern: he have deep problems with self-image, smokes pot all day, is surrounded by stoners and people who abuse him and is a drug dealer. I personally don’t think he is going to overcome this situation very soon, especially because of his distrust in his secondary Se (he sees himself as ugly, fat and lacking motor coordination). If an ISFP is unable to accept his secondary Se (for whatever reason), then it’s all lost, they’re probably gonna become frustrated hedonists who will get trapped in self-indulgence, stagnant patterns, addictive behavior and lack of future perspectives.
I’d love to find ISFPs who were interested in developing Se, because it would help me a lot (being Se my inferior function), and I could give them insights into sensorial experience as a form of perceiving the divine. Being intuition and sensation the functions that deal with reality apreehension, I think that these are the key functions to experience the Ultimate reality, and ISFPs are very prone to understand, accept and especially practice this. It’s such a shame that finding a healthy, sensual and dedicated-to-practice ISFP depends so much on his/her past experience, and very little about what you can give/say/show to them. It’s like they are tied to their past/family/groups/society and break some of the rules for the fun of doing it, but aren’t really the owners of their lives, and are often slaves of a group, a family, a background, a college degree in engineering (or any other heavy thinking profession which is supported by family or groups), an image about themselves which they once thought was true, etc.
Love, Blake!
Jared Leto of 30 Seconds to Mars comes to mind.
I have actually seen these characteristics in my young 4 year old ISFP son. He can definitively be a bully and it can of scares me… he likes to push people’s buttons. He is also an incredibly beautiful and attractive child, he kind of fascinates everybody and has this massive appeal in him. It is incredible to watch. And then there is the sensitive side at times. I wonder what is a good career for an ISFP. Artists of some kind?
Yeah, artist of some kind. ISFPs are good at mastering an instrument assuming they are interested in it in the first place. I think with an ISFP you gotta tune in to what they have a passion for and give them the materials to explore that passion. Like with most kids I suppose. But, with ISFP it seems they can become truant if they aren’t given something to keep them out of trouble and a tendency to drift. Or be emotional bullies. Or be pushed around themselves. If they have that one thing that they can really get into, it makes a world of difference. I think. The key is finding that thing that they really dig. They have a natural tendency to be good at getting into that thing and eating the hell out of it and then it becomes a productive and life-enhancing thing.
If they don’t find that thing and can’t find a healthy and productive outlet, then I think it is easy for them to drift into more destructive ones. And as I said, the early conditioning and climate of an ISFP (and INFP to some extent) make a big difference on how they will turn out. Fi doms soak up indiscriminately whatever is there. They have a great facility for receiving and internalizing impressions. Taking things in whole, as it were. So, it depends what gets in there.
In general, ISFPs are artisan types as Kiersey suggests. Whereas, ISTPs make great natural mechanics, ISFPs make great natural instrumentalists. They are both good with the concept known as “tools”. People that are good with tools are good with their hands and like to have their bodies engaged in the learning and inquiry experience. Kinesthetic gifts. ISTPs are good with mechanical tools and ISFPs are good with emotional tools such as guitars, paintbrushes, sculpting clays, and the like. When people speak of the concept of an instrument becoming like an extension of one’s body they are talking about ISFPs. And ISTPs in this other context. They become one with the car or the guitar. ISFP is probaly the most non-verbal of all types and it seems many of the famous ones would rather play their instrument than talk. The instrument stands in for them.
Artist is not the only profession open to them but it stands as a good archetype for this type. And generally, they are not artists in the INFJ sense of expressing great universal and symbolic truths, which would be the definition of an artist since the Romantic era, the mouthpiece of god-type thing. No, ISFPs are much more humble artisan types. It is more that they want to express their instrument and its capacities rather than any high-falutin collective conscious thing.
ISFPs correspond to Scorpio in the ascendant. I’ve personally noticed a huge difference between the way Scorpios are generally described and the characteristics of of ISFPs, however. Perhaps it’s the rulership of Pluto, but the sign of Scorpio is always steeped in issues of power, secret power. It is usually described as deeply in tune with dark realities, with the secrets people hide, and with one’s own inner character. It involves emotional upheavals that break up old patterns, layers of ego death, complete transformation. Intensity, insight, conniving. Lots of intuitive concepts.
ISFPS, on the other hand, are rarely understood this way. Perhaps this is just ignorance on the part of most typologists, but they are usually described as somewhat vacuous; a hint of this is even detectable in your description. This is somewhat true, but more in a psychological sense than the stereotypical one. More like dissociative. You said INTJs are the most schizotypal type; I think ISFPs are the most dissociative. Like, sometimes they just completely disengage, not in deep thought either, just complete evacuation of the psyche and extreme hypnotic receptivity. I think a lot of pop stars are ISFPs living out the dreams of their parents: Beyonce and Janet Jackson come to mind. Watch some of their more obscure interviews and they come off as though they were mind-controlled. They also have this ability to enter trance-like states in which they become very different personalities, as if they were channeling someone else. Perhaps this is Scorpios connection to the demonic. Unlike Piscean Fi, though, all these expressions come IN THE MOMENT, like very intense, impactful, time-bound experiences.
On the positive side, ISFPs do seem to see deeper in your character. Like INFJs, they seem to be vaults for people’s secrets, but it’s not as big a deal to them as it is to us. Like, it is what it is, seems to be their attitude, and they don’t really look for meaning in it. They seem to always witness bad, embarrassing things, but just kindly nestle these in their heart, aware, but ever discreet. And when they activate that Ni…. Forget about it. Janets The Velvet Rope was freakin INFJ level insight, and Beyonces latest tackled self-definition and expression in a way few performers of her status ever approach. They are an endlessly fascinating type to me, as I see myself in them in many ways. I just can’t do it like they can.
Yes, there are some discrepancies between Scorpio Ascendant and Fi dominance, which would be somewhat analogous (by my lights), though in a manner that would need more clarification.
Actually, I think I see ISFPs that could have Fi Pisces dominant too. Some of those hippie drifter type of ISFPs. Not sure. Some ISFPs definitely tend more to the bully side and others more to the “getting off the wheel of life” side. I suppose Scorpio could have something to do with both cases. Scorpio has been described by one particularly insightful writer on the subject as both the “strongest and weakest sign”. I would agree with this.
Yes, I could see the “disassociative” thing you mention. ISFPs are certainly not schizotypal. There Ni tends to be perfect and in just the right amount. It isn’t strong enough or primary enough to send them into schizophrenic breakdown. Ego-orientating by Ni is what seems to cause schizophrenic breakdowns by and large. Of course there will be exceptions but as a general rule it doesn’t seem unreasonable.
I think ISFPs do have an insight into people’s characters that is kind of ancillary to their main thrust. It may be in the nature of a certain amusement, sort of playful and new. They don’t get pulled out of their depths as a general rule because of these insights into human nature. It actually operates in a highly positive and refreshing capacity in them when they get their grounding going. ISFP is predisposed to have great ground state calibration, which is why many of them can take psychoactive drugs with relative impunity.
So, cool.
Could you expound more on the concept of “ground state calibration”? Sounds very interesting, and like something an INFJ would have very little of.
I noticed that you don’t seem to mention or care to share any insight about the female ISFP. Is there a reason for this?
It’s just the way the article came out. I was thinking of bullies, rock guitarists, and smoldering studs. You can take much of this and apply it to the women of the type. They are kind of bitchy and subdued all at the same time, similar to the guys. Similar dedication to a craft. I just don’t know of any famous ISFP rock guitarists for example. Mostly a male thing. As for the bullied and bully dynamic, I think it is similar, except that the woman will be less out-front about it. I think many of the men of the type are reacting against the deep feminine energy of Fi and so often compensate by being bullies. It is less acceptable for them to show this type of energy in male-dominant contexts. For women, it is expected of them. So, there is definitely some difference between the male and the female of the species. But, there is a lot of overlap as well.
What do you want to know about ISFP women? Maybe I’ll write an article about it if you ask me a good enough question.
I grew up with a female ISFP, who also seems to be an enneagram 8 for what it’s worth. Honestly from what I’ve seen, that sense of rebelling against femininity of Fi is stronger in the girl than the two male ISFPs I know. The men have a confidence in their masculinity that I think comes from Se, so they seem comfortable with how much softness they’re showing. They know what it says and what it doesn’t. But the girl.. Imagine having the personality described here, then a whole life of people expecting you to be soft and sweet and obliging. The result is that she can shred even the toughest guys with a split second side glance. The ISFP guys give people enough room to influence them (though I think they mostly just offer it to watch what people do with it). The girl? No. Maybe because the men know they can establish boundaries when needed and be respected. But people assume women will keep giving and giving. She’s warm and absolutely vibrant with family and close friends. For everyone else, she’s this terrifying icy fierce concept, who somehow still seems quiet and like she isn’t even trying.
I was curious about female ISFP’s as well, Rebekah.
Blake, I agree that the women are similar. We really are a complex type. I recently became infatuated, or maybe in love, with a girl that I knew was ISFP while she and her boyfriend were broken up (they got back together). We shared a lot of the taste in music, style, and culture – she’s also stunning – needless to say I passionately pursued her, and she was privy to all of my advances and forms of love. I read in socionics that mirror relations as well as duals are common first loves. It was an amazing dynamic… we understood each other so well. If I didn’t walk in on her and her whack boyfriend, I would’ve kept on.
I’m currently in the rogue realization phase of my life that you mentioned, and now just want to find the right woman to partner with while becoming more career focused. Could you write another article on our strengths and career ambitions?
Friend zoned…So can I ask Jay, what did he have that you didn’t? I understand that your last paragraph emphasizes that you would like to move on, but this is a personality blog, yes? This interests me. Would you mind humoring me?
E, yes thank you for the extra salt. I’ll try.
Well, I won’t go into comparing myself, but will say the situation was misjudged. I knew she was recently single and acknowledged that she was trying to move on, but she wasn’t as far long along as I originally thought. Although I was winning her heart, it was never truly mine yet. Now that the short dream is over, I realize that they break up often like this for whatever reason.
Thanks for replying Jay. After I read what I typed, it sounded a bit harsh. Especially since you can’t hear my good-natured tone. Sorry about the salt, at least I wasn’t blood-letting you.
I wont ask your specific age in case you wish not to disclose it, but give me a range. 18-29? 30-39? 40 and over?
Let me be honest. I’m only saying this because I’ve been in a similar situation. It sounds like you’re not necessarily trying to find the one, rather you’re trying to forget the one.
Lol no worries, e – I appreciate the apology. I was being facetious for myself. She is still the first thing on my mind every morning – but the feelings paired with thoughts have changed accordingly.
I’m 27.
Friendzone stings because it’s the truth… your latter observation might have some truth as well. The thing is, I subscribe to the “3 great women” in our lifetime from the movie A Bronx Tale. I believe there could be more than 3, but I don’t believe in just the one, although one is probably the best. At this age, my first real love was with my dual, an ENTP when I first started college. That was my one turbulent relationship to date. Even though it was years ago, I kept getting similar feelings with this current girl. I attributed it to the level of attraction being matched. It was an eerie awareness – reminding myself of all the mistakes I didn’t want to make again. You’re right though… I want to find another girl to help me forget about her. Please share some information about yourself and your situation if you’d like, I would like to know.
Jay, too many shadowed details for my situation. It will never leave me, and I don’t want it to. I don’t want to pretend I’ll get over everything to just feel normal, when I know I’ll never get over my experience. I’m pretty content with abnormal-ness anyways. My feelings towards my experiences have morphed over the years. I am in a pleasant place right now. That is all I’d like to share.
Blake, what is your MBTI?
JKLMNOP
Haha very funny. It was just out of curiosity. If you prefer to remain “anonymous” it’s cool.
Ok e, that’s good. I’m not a stranger to your disposition. Eternal Sunshine of the spotless mind was was my favorite movie at one point… It was the best artistic example of a love gone dark. Keep bettering you’re situation though.
Hi Rebekah,
I’m not Blake. I shouldn’t have answered for him, only I knew he wouldn’t answer, and I saw an opportunity. An opportunity that tickled.
Was going to turn off my computer to experience some more flow today (thank you for the flow articles, and yes, I self-confirmed as an undeniable INFJ and am greatly benefiting from the insights on here, most of them uncannily spot on), but this very flow made me leave a comment on this article before I do go offline 🙂
I am in a relationship with someone who is most probably an ISFP by all characteristics. No other type really fits, and the all-giving attitude both towards his organization and to me kinda confirms it. He is very artistic but in terms of crafts and learning new things immediately, like cooking, and turning them into something very creative, and though he does not make art he can definitely appreciate it…
The things is, he puzzles the hell out of me. Like, sometimes all I see is this blandness that you described here only to find out later that he was hiding some treasures inside, but it’s not like opening a treasure chest, it’s like… It appears out of nowhere every time. He is the most honest person, but I feel like he has so many different faces, yet not in an intriguing sort of way, but in a way that makes you intrigued only once you’ve seen one of those faces, and only for a brief time, you know what I mean?
He gets (and loves) darkness and he gets depth and he will decipher my INTJ struggles better than myself and sum them up concisely in a spot-on metaphor, and then he will just melt away into the corporate kind of thing. Or, not really. Even at work he is his own, not letting anyone into his territory, but at the same time blending into the background like he is not there.
The reason we are together is that the connection we formed spontaneously was the deepest, and most natural, thing I have ever experienced, like I finally found a glimpse of this vast infinity-eternity sort of thing I wake up with everyday in a certain person. But at the same time I cannot really pinpoint it. And I bet he cannot. It’s like, he himself doesn’t really know what he has inside. A very strange and elusive depth… Which, when it becomes invisible, leaves me Ti-ing unnecessarily if I did not make the wrong choice, yet there he is again, changing his face and showing the glimpse of ancient something.
In total absence of his own identifiable needs.
Would this be a developed Ni thing?
Or unlikely to be ISFP?
Would appreciate any comment, but I do understand it is a complex issue and if you don’t comment that’s fine, I got my flow already 🙂
Sorry, I meant INFJ struggles
Well I will just answer myself since I was just getting into MBTI at the time of writing, and since reading your stuff on INFPs I realized that he was actually an INFP.
The “invisibility” of the first two functions combined with lack of any overtly “artistic” talent such as writing or composing made me have the exact impression of him that I had described above.
And the inexplicable feeling of connection comes from Ni id, apparently.
I suppose an INFJ will spend a life doubting regardless of who they are (or are not) with, but at least the intricacies of INFJ-INFP relationship in terms of differences and similarities seem much less dreadful than the S-N divide. 🙂
The fact that he has mastered the “flow” of Ne quite well does clash with my rather OCD J-aspect, though.
Not to mention Ni and Fi id interplay, as in
“Why are you not trying to figure out the meaning of all existence the second you wake up? WHY?? You will NEVER ever understand the depth of my world, where I am forever alone. Yes, despite the fact that you love me unconditionally, even in the grip of my self-destruction. Or, rather, that is the exact reason why you will never understand me. Cause I am someplace else when you are trying to melt into me”.
Reading about INFPs made it so much clearer though 🙂
Gloria Steinem is very ISFP. I suspect Eleanor Roosevelt was ISFP as well.
There is a thing about Fi. It arises in the face of abuse, or injustice, or some other childhood maltreatment. I think it’s the quality I see in both INFP and ISFP that is their utter refusal, even inability, to go against whatever Fi seems to be insisting must be defended.
Anywhere you find a group including the term “sisterhood” . . . you’ve probably got some ISFP’s.
Every male ISFP I know is just an out-and-out fuck up. Worst judgment ever. For whatever reason, female ISFP’s seem to get more of a pass for the distant, dreamy eyed cum crazy psycho bitch dynamic that seems to accompany them. Let’s also not forget how many wealthy, powerful male ENTJ’s end up partnered with pretty-but-seemingly-airheaded ISFP women.
Speaking to the INTJ/ISFP pairing . . . it’s a sort of natural match. Any of the NT’s with SF’s can hit some high energy portions of each’s psyche.
ISFP sees beauty in everything, but no meaning in anything. INTJ sees meaning in everything, but nothing excellent, nothing beautiful, nothing that isn’t corrupted, nothing above judgment. So they can end up embodying what each wishes they could find but can’t in the world.
” Every male ISFP I know is just an out-and-out fuck up. Worst judgment ever. ”
Is worst judgement always = an out-and-out fuck up to you ?
” “Why are you not trying to figure out the meaning of all existence the second you wake up? WHY?? ”
lol I know this so well but generally with people. It’s funny to read that in print and by another person.
@anna: You wrote, “Why are you not trying to figure out the meaning of all existence the second you wake up? WHY?? ” And then I thanked god for someone putting my inner experience into words that normal people can relate to. Well expressed, that *really* is what Fi an Ni combine to produce.
@*: You wrote, “Is worst judgement always = an out-and-out fuck up to you ?” My answer is a solid “maybe”. Bad judgment always catches up with one – it’s like rolling the dice of bad decision making every time you have to exercise judgment. Sooner or later, the house (laws of nature) always wins.
If someone consistently exercises poor judgment and they’re not a fuckup, it’s only a matter of time. They’re not a fuckup . . . yet. The only options are 1) position yourself beneath someone with better judgment and follow their leadership, 2) withdraw from the world in any meaningful way so all your fuckups are minor, or 3) just go be a fuckup with engines on full, own that shit and laugh at your own fuckupery, and try to get by with being likable and relatable. (This last option is a legit option, BTW).
Love it. Got here from a google search, looking for ISFP stuff. I have to say its the most accurate outside perspective I ever had.
I have lived without a tent, but with a tarp. Broken with this world, to be alive, more and more. Coincidentally I did realize who-what I am. There is this thing called soul, and its the most important discovery you can imagine.
I will read the comments now. And see if there is something else to this maze-place.
Stellar content 🙂
I’ve read many ISFP articles and this is unbelieavably accurate for myself. Thank you for validating my machismo/bravado/sweetness ascepts and many faces.
I’m still struggling to get a handle on male ISFP’s.
I just watched a documentary on Ted Haggard (post scandal) and BY GOD if I didn’t come away from watching that thing genuinely liking Haggard and some lizard part of my brain rooting for him him to make a come back.
My best guess is ISFP. Anyone care to confirm or deny? Documentary available at the link: http://documentarystorm.com/the-trials-of-ted-haggard/
some of your terminology cracks me up! i see a lot of my ISFP boyfriend in this. he is a 6 in the enneagram, it seems that the phobic/counterphobic “thing” is being illustrated here too, hmm. he’s a pisces with aquarius rising and a cancer moon…i think that pretty much illustrates the sentence “They present a dichotomy (trichotomy?) between a lover, a leaver, and a clinger.”
I randomly came across this and it had me mostly laughing but also cringing a few times. Wow, a lot of this is very true. Many of these things I have become aware of and learned to take the good with the bad. Just wouldn’t have been able to write and articulate in such a creative and brilliant manner as you did. Some of the explanations, at least for me is a bit exaggerated, though that adds enhances the humor. I am a male ISFP. I can be gentle or fierce. I have learned to embrace the gentle side too as I have gotten a little older (30s). I appreciate this perspective. I apologize if I missed this, but I am curious, what is your personality type?
For me as an ISFP the whole explaination comes down to two things, respect and personal freedom. ISFPs don’t want to control nor be controlled.
I had to come back and reread this article. I know a few ISFPs. I was wondering why they can be kind of inconsistent. (And I’m probably not one to judge on that. Although, I prefer “multifaceted” – and maybe I should be that generous with them as well.) But, yeah, I’ve noticed how we will hang out and have a great conversation and the atmosphere is like organically smooth. Then, the next time, they’ll be kind of “awkward” or closed-off, and I’m worried that they’re uncomfortable because they exposed too much of themselves with me previously. So, then I’m like adjusting myself to let them know I respect their boundaries: “Yeah, sure, okay, this is fine too. I’ll flow with this.” And then it’s all just kind of nice and cool and fine. But, then another time, it’s back to everything being in mind-mate realm (as long as I don’t go too….idk), and it’s like the “awkward” time before was just a glitch. Anyway, I think this article has helped me understand it better. I still haven’t mastered a way to orient myself before I’m with them so that I’m not subjected to this little dance every time, but, maybe I shouldn’t worry about it? Just kind of dance and let them lead and say thanks for the dance and then go on my merry way? I just hate when it’s the “awkward” mode because other-people-feeling-uncomfortable is the worst. I know: it’s not my responsibility. Ugh. 🙂
This is exactly how I’ve been feeling with my ISFP male! I thought it was me. One time he demands that I be his girlfriend (in a sweet way) and it’s connected the next he’s very distant and barely wants to touch me and just clams up. He has Venus in Gemini and Mars in Cancer which adds to this on and off style. Will this never end or will it smooth out once he trusts me?What would make an INFJ/ISFP relationship work or are they just not meant for relationships altogether?!
I’d need to know more about your personal situation to answer that question satisfactorily. So, consult or forever hold your peace!
This article on ISFPs and the other on INFJs (least likely to be who you think they are) are really really excellent.
I so agree Lunar!
This article FINALLY enabled me to type my mother and my former partner with certainty. Blake hits the nail on the head about these ISFP paradoxes: the weakness and the strength, the commitment and the need for freedom, the martyrdom and the bullying, the humbleness and the superiority, the wannabe ENTJ coupled with disdain for everything ENTJs stand for. I also agree with Jerry’s comment that ISFPs want neither to control nor to be controlled. If I had to choose one word to describe them it would be ‘paradoxical’.
I sometimes wonder if they’re the most dangerous of all types for an INFJ, quietly mesmerising and then surprising you not with hidden depths but hidden shallows…
They seem really deep, really complex, really together in a way that smacks of brilliant self-mastery; they argue they’re not whilst continuing to give off this cool, complex vibe. Then as you get to know them you see glimpses of a much shallower reality and they laugh saying “Told you so”. To an NF this doesn’t compute so you’re scratching your head wondering is this a bluff or even a double-bluff, which of course is what NF would like it to be….At times they remind me of Sir Percy Blakeney aka The Scarlet Pimpernel, so cool and so dumb.
My ex had a degree in philosophy and when I met him he gave the impression of being a deep thinker. Later he told me he rocked up at university enrolment on a whim, flirted with the philosophy lecturer, decided the course would be easy and went for it with no further contemplation and zero interest in the subject but worked hard with no complaint. He maintained he should have studied accountancy (I used to wonder if he was ISTJ but it was a poor overall fit) and to this day I don’t know if he was bluffing.
Adjectives I’d use to describe my mother and my ex are nice, gentle, reliable, calm, easy-going, attractive, responsible, hard-working, resilient, practical, independent, intelligent, artistic, flirtatious, self-contained, orderly, cultured, quiet, observant, compliant, selfish, rebellious, self-effacing, shy, confident, daring, conventional, commitment-phobic, secretive. Both were peaceable but with a fascination for violence. What they weren’t is kind.
I’ve been giving a lot of thought lately to the difference between ‘nice’ and ‘kind’ and I’d say generally ISFPs are nice but not kind, whereas INFJs are kind but not nice. I think the ISFPs in my life liked and admired kindness in others, also despised it and saw it as weakness and definitely exploited it. When I read Blake’s comment about ISFPs’ occasional stinging comments, it was a very strong ‘tell’. I have never known anyone deliver such crippling comments as my mum; only once in a blue moon, seemingly out-of-the-blue, never in the heat of the moment and with no sign of later remorse. The first time I saw my ex do it it was like deja vu. ISFPs know EXACTLY how to wound and use it as intermittent reinforcement – a reminder that they know a damned sight more about you than they usually let on – glimpses of their Ni at work.
I take Blake’s point about upbringing and both of mine had difficult childhoods with a lot of neglect for different reasons. They must have had real strength and determination to get where they did. Confusingly, they seemed to both appreciate and despise those who had helped them along the way. They never bothered keeping in touch with people from the past. My ex has a younger half-brother he got on well with but hasn’t contacted for ten years. “Would you like to see him?” “Why?”
I’ve never met anyone who gives off such a consistently warm, alluring vibe yet is so disdainful of attachment, so self-contained. A mirage really, a will o’the wisp. A practical, reliable, will o’the wisp. A complete contradictory, puzzling mind-fuck… Lovers of secrets (I’d go so far as to say having secrets is necessary to their sense of self) who describe themselves as simple, straightforward folk. Are they, aren’t they?
I see a similarity between ISFPs and INFJs needing the feeling that there is a rich hinterland behind them, sustaining their sense of self, if that makes sense? I’m thinking out loud here but sense that with INFJs it’s metaphysical: memories of thoughts, insights, intuitions, glimpses, whereas with ISFPs it’s temporal: memories of secrets and times they’ve lived on the edge (clandestine relationships, drugs, breaking the law, walking away from everything into the blue yonder etc).
Although I agree ISFPs live in the present moment and experience life as it presents itself, I have found they also look back on past impulsive decisions with puzzlement and enjoy a sort of masochistic pondering about what might have been. For example, my mum would sometimes talk about two men she jilted in her 20s, the life she could have had with them. My ex would look back with bewilderment about his unplanned decision to fold the pretty successful band he was in on his 30th birthday.
I never heard either of them wonder what happened to any of the other people affected by these decisions; perhaps that’s painful stuff ISFPs ponder inside their heads in the small hours, perhaps not…
Karen, thank you for your post. Fascinating. The other day I read a fascinating post by an isfp. He or she was describing how it was to read the usual isfp description but know all this paradoxical tendencies that are left out of the usual descriptions. Feeling for others but also looking down that they don’t get over it etc. and more. Feeling both ways and being able to go both ways. It was really cool to see Blake’s description get that.
It is funny you mention the isfp not seeing family. The one I know is similar.
Karen, feel free to go more into the distinction between nice and kind:)
Karen,
“I sometimes wonder if they’re the most dangerous of all types for an INFJ, quietly mesmerising and then surprising you not with hidden depths but hidden shallows…”
I cannot speak for other INFJs, but in my experience they are MY most dangerous type. I admire them from a long distance now. I won’t be fooled again. They are intriguing creatures of beauty, depth, feeling, and also suddenly shallow and can only consistently offer random inconsistency. I think their hearts are beautiful and they are capable of deep sincere love, but that Se will lead them to embrace in an instant that which they had only yesterday vowed was something they wanted nothing to do with. Their sands shift a lot. Blake outdid himself with this article. It really is brilliant. There is a borderline quality to them. I’m not saying they all have borderline personality disorder (although mine did), but it is something of that flavor you will see not too infrequently in this type. “Lovers, leavers, and clingers” is a perfect way to describe these lovely nightmarish (for me) creatures.
Hi Rita! “Lovers, leavers and clingers.” Sums it up brilliantly, doesn’t it?
I’m surprised about the borderline tendencies. My ISFPs shifted sands quietly, subtly; no drama or histrionics ever. I’d go so far as to say the absence of histrionics was one of their defining features. It’s a reason I still don’t get Russell Brand as an ISFP.
“This is them doing that opposite thing of totally not belonging to a clan and effectively wandering and roving around in nature or something, just totally turned off from society and all its etiquettes and even the etiquettes of their chosen clan. They just go mutinous. And it seems here they are very strong in a way, stronger than any other type – they are just beholden to…not a vision…well, a slight vision…but more just the principle of not belonging to anyone. One’s life being their own. We are in this circle of life and they can carry on from it in a way that is very admirable. Like being sly stoners on the outskirts of town. Not participating in karmic debts or gains anymore, realizing that all of life is just natural and amoral in the sense of man’s created and interpreted laws. Hard to bullshit or fool these ones. They are very grounded and persistent…and practical.”
I know one of these ISFPs. You have described nearly word for word how she operates. You are really good at this. I mean we all notice some things about people, but it’s way beyond that to be able to actually describe types so well like you do. I wonder how many years you’ve been thinking about this stuff….. Damm. You are really good.
I think this article is the biggest pile of rubbish ive ever read on isfps. Just one persons view on a type that is nothing like me or any of the other dozens of isfps.
OK Lucy, for starters, how is it a big pile of rubbish? Be more specific. What specifically in this article is a big pile or rubbish?
Also, how do you know that the information herein that purports to describe ISFP does not apply to many ISFPs?
Isfps hold the prospect of entjs inside them.
I wonder if something similar goes with istps…that they hold the prospect of enfj inside them. Like to satisfy their desire to belong they will seek the uncle role. Possibly fully understanding why.
And like with isfps they can take on many looks. The squinty-eyed Clint Eastwood look. The almost intj insightful look (Ti plus Ni) where you are like hey there is more to this other wise laidback seeming individual.
There is a lot of overlap between types. For example, ISTP and ISFP are look-a-like types due to having same aux. function of Se. ISFP is similar to INFJ because the former is the natural mother of the latter. The exact opposite type is often confused for the type because of the concept of “echoing” and so on. However, there are definitely less likely types that any given type will resemble or be overlapping/mistaken with.
Like, it is highly unlikely an ISFP can be mistaken for an ENTP. But, actually, in the case of the Russell Brand type challenge that did happen.
It’s a tricky business. And no one can be the sole arbiter. But, it is interesting to explore and muse over these functions and types and so on. Good fun, I would say.
I’m as ISFP as you can get and don’t think this is too accurate. While some of it resonates with me quite a lot the main points don’t seem accurate IMO: being bullies (ISFPs are least likely to want to control others and have no interest i n bullying or ego), weak (I think ISFPs are very strong in a quiet, maybe not noticeable to the average person type way, but internally very strong). I also disagree about responding to harshness, groups, and tyrants–that seems opposite of ISFP we are very individualistic, do our own thing and don’t respond well to being controlled or attempts to control us. I’m curious how you came up with these parts of your analysis.
Other parts like drifters, dropouts, craft focused ring very true, as well as not idealistic, hard worker by nature, lives by own code, and some other parts.
We are also very private, very into beauty, technique, sensation, can be very supportive, and encouraging and enthusiastic and can be hard on ourselves. And artisans is quite accurate. But other parts, as mentioned above, made no sense to me based on experience, observation, and everything I’ve studied about ISFP and MBTI.