The primary difference between an ENTP and an ENTJ is that ENTPs are party animal scientists and ENTJs are heavy-hitting motherfuckers that you don’t want to fuck with.
It is easy to spot the difference between the two types when you know what to look for.
Some famous ENTPs: George Carlin, Bill Hicks, Douglas Adams (Hitchhiker’s Guide to Galaxy), Stephen Colbert, Conan O’ Brien, Tom Green (Tom Green show), and Jason Schwartzman (Rushmore movie).
Notice anything?
That’s right. ENTPs are funny stand-up comedian types, often with witty and biting social commentary. They are arguably the most hilarious types around. ENTPs like to lampoon and make fun of shit; social mores, customs, etiquette, political correctness, and in short, anything that people take way too seriously. And ENTPs often do this quite intelligently.
Speaking of intelligence, some ENTPs are the most intelligent creatures to land in the world of science.
I’ll give you two words: Albert Einstein.
I know a lot of people think he is an INTP, but what can I say, they are wrong. Way too irreverent a guy to be an INTP. Though, I think Einstein falls at type 9 on the enneagram rather than at the far more common place for ENTPs of type 7.
Ready for another name? Richard Feynman.
If you don’t know who he is, look him up. He won the Nobel Prize for his groundbreaking work in quantum electrodynamics. Also has a book out entitled, “Surely, You’re Joking Mr. Feynman!” That sums up ENTPs very well. Jokes mixed with some heady scientific shit. Like quantum electrodynamics.
OK, another that is a bit more recent. Remember the guy who wrote the book, Infinite Jest? He goes by the name of David Foster Wallace. Check him out. He was a brilliant math guy that could also write fictional novels extremely well.
Infinite Jest. That sums up ENTPs too well. Incidentally, that title is also based on a line from Hamlet. Ring any bells?
In a nutshell, ENTPs blend comedy and science in a rather awesome way.
Now for the cocksucking motherfuckers.
OK, first of all, ENTJs come in three different flavors and these flavors are based on a little thing called the enneagram. If you don’t know what the enneagram is, look it up. Basically, in addition to being one of the Myers-Briggs personality types, that personality type falls at one of the points of the enneagram. There are 9 points.
Don’t worry about it. Just know that I have observed that there are three different types of ENTJ, which I attribute and assign to one of these 9 points.
So, there is the type 8 ENTJ, which is the classical type, the type 7 ENTJ, which is a midlevel type, and the type 3 ENTJ, which many might not recognize as ENTJ at all because they are the least harsh kind of ENTJ. Also, the most attractive ENTJs. Everyone wants to be with them.
Some famous type 8 ENTJs: Aleister Crowley, Jack Nicholson, Mother Teresa (just seeing if you’re paying attention)
Some famous type 7 ENTJs: Johnny Rotten (Sex Pistol), Gordon Ramsay (of the Hell’s Kitchen show), Howard Stern, Ginger Baker (drummer of the band Cream)
Some famous type 3 ENTJs: Milla Jovovich, Mick Jagger, David Bowie, Elizabeth Taylor
What is the most generally true thing for all the different ENTJs?
Authority, kingship, ego, strong personalities, command, harshness, and, well, I’ll give you some words from type 3 ENTJ, Axl Rose, to sum it up:
I’m a cold heartbreaker fit to burn
I’ll rip your heart in two
And I’ll leave you lying on the bed
Ah, the poetry of assholedom.
The J in the type code clues us in. ENTJs are Judgers, whereas, ENTPs are perceivers. ENTJs are some of the nastiest judgers around. ENTPs, by comparison, are extremely non-judgmental and tolerant of people, ideas, and concepts.
Not so with an ENTJ. Picture a military commander (if they are an 8), or a commando (if they are a 5), or a cold heartbreaker (if they are a three). There is something decidedly militaristic and organizing of people, ideas, and things into their proper ranks and files. ENTJs insist everyone be put in their proper place. And they will put you in your motherfucking place, believe me.
ENTPs are not like this at all. Things will sort themselves out. They have no interest in putting people into their place unless they are infringing upon other people’s liberties. That is the real key to ENTP, liberty and freedom. They insist on the maximum freedom for themselves and all people.
Because ENTPs are NT types (Rationals) they will be into hierarchy, order, discipline, and well, rationalism like their ENTJ brethren (and sistas!).
But, ENTPs are the type of that category that most flaunts their irreverence towards rules, categories, ethics, orders and all that stuff that ENTJs insist on.
ENTJs do the most to enforce the dictates of their Rational background because they are double-choleric types, which means they don’t have the time to fuck around. They don’t suffer fools gladly and they believe in getting shit done no matter who gets hurt in the process.
ENTPs think all that shit is corny. They treat the things of their Rational domain like playthings. Logic is fun and they use it like a toy. They are extremely facile with out-quipping other people and taking them down a peg or two, but it is all in the spirit of fun. See people like George Carlin and Stephen Colbert for this expert quality of deflating people with their fast and furious logic arrows. They can make people look like fools while themselves acting like fools. Nice gift they have.
Ironically, ENTPs can be more effective through this silly and irreverent mode of theirs than 10 ENTJs put together. ENTJs tend to put the average person off with their bluster and lack of sensitivity. ENTPs get away with being insensitive because they are so funny. But, ENTP insensitivity is not anything deep or sociopathic. They are simply completely oblivious to people’s deep emotions.
ENTJs are not funny. You will get an air of some kind of seriousness and intensity from them. They do not fuck around.
The ENTJ types that are most hard to discern from an ENTP are the type 7 ENTJs. That is because they both share the same point on the enneagram. But, even here it isn’t hard to separate the two from each other. The ENTJs are way too harsh for an ENTP to be confused with them. People like Johnny Rotten, Simon Cowell (American Idol), Howard Stern, and Evel Knievel are type 7 ENTJs. Many of them are daredevils of one sort or another. They take risks that shock other people, often these risks involve some kind of extraverted sensation component, which is another great way to separate an ENTJ from an ENTP.
ENTPs have next to no extraverted sensation, which means they are a bunch of pansies compared to an ENTJ. No ENTP is going to get in someone’s face and scream that they are a bleeding cunt because they aren’t up to snuff in their kitchen duties such as a personality like Chef Gordon Ramsay would do.
No, an ENTP wouldn’t even care if someone was making an ass of themselves in the kitchen. Hell, ENTPs are the ones that ENTJs are bound to be yelling at for dereliction of duty, except they wouldn’t dare, because ENTPs are generally too clever and facile to get chewed out by anyone, except their parents. See Tom Green of the Tom Green show. He got away with murder.
No, there is something about ENTPs that keeps them off the firing lines. They seem to be exempt in some way. An ENTJ would probably consider them too inconsequential and too competent in some way to dress them down. Even if you try to dress down an ENTP, well, good luck is all I can say. They are slippery sons of bitches, like natural-born lawyer-jesters, they will weave a web of words and logic around you and completely throw you off them. They are really good at this. No one has ever got the best of an ENTP. They will make you wonder what the hell you were talking about in the first place.
ENTPs know how to diffuse emotional and physical violence by being completely other to it, like in some alternate cartoon dimension to it that makes you look so completely ridiculous when you address them in this way, which you probably wouldn’t even have the desire to in the first place. They just don’t attract that sort of thing to themselves.
No, if an ENTJ is yelling at someone in a rage it will be some hapless sensor type. The type 7 ENTJs are some of the nastiest fucks on the face of the earth and extremely tough. They have a ton of energy (just like ENTPs) but this energy is primed to get in your fucking face if you fuck up on their watch or turf.
To be fair, if you don’t do either of those last two things than they will leave you alone. It is more if you willingly entered into some kind of interaction, relationship, or gasp, contractual agreement (such as wanting to participate on the Howard Stern show or be on Gordon Ramsay’s Hell’s Kitchen show) then you gonna be in for a time and a trial. If for some reason you are in one of these guy’s crosshairs, forget about it, you fucked. They pull no punches and will kick you down to the floor and then kick you in the face when you are there.
Probaly the most explosively violent of all types, these 7 ENTJs. They get off on the tension, the risk, the violence, like the scent of blood drives a shark into a feeding frenzy. Once you are bleeding a little bit, they want you to bleed even more. Suffice to say, they are some nasty bastards if they perceive you to be in some way fucking with them or just fucking up in their territory.
ENTPs couldn’t be farther removed from this sort of violence. The only kind of violence ENTPs have is cartoon violence. They are violent on some level to be sure but they would never ever dream of hitting someone in a fit of rage. ENTPs don’t really have fits of rage. They don’t get caught up in all that low-level physical and emotional violence. Concepts such as vengeance and physical retaliation are like alien concepts to these aliens.
Type 8 ENTJs? They’ll just get someone else to come and break your legs. Of what use has a king for dirtying his hands with your peasant blood.
Type 3 ENTJs will probably just confine themselves to breaking your heart or something mild like that. Unless they are Axl Rose, in which case, they will smack you upside your fucking head. But, only if you fuck with them.
Takeaways: Don’t fuck with ENTJs. They will make you bleed or break.
You could fuck with an ENTP but you probably wouldn’t have the least desire to do so.
Unless they were Socrates. But, they only made him drink hemlock after years and years of him “corrupting the youths of Athens.” Since Socrates pretty much gave birth to the Western mode of thinking and ironic detachment and all that, I would say he won.
You just can’t get the best of an ENTP. By the time you get around to killing them, they have already revolutionized whole worlds of thought.
Well, hope that helps you cut through all the hoopla.
Entp here, this post was hilarious and very accurate in many ways. I can’t really recall a time anyone tried to seriously fight me. I remember once in high school someone I didn’t know that well tried to rile me up but I actually laughed in his face and then he just walked off when he saw he couldn’t provoke me haha. I’ve thought that our general confidence might have something to do with avoiding fights or people trying to fuck with us too much because they may sense that we’re not a person to back down or be intimidated. Something about the person you’re trying to pick a fight with looking amused at the situation might be a bit unsettling, haha. I don’t really get angry either, not in a visceral or immediate way that others seem to. I get more upset after analyzing something, and it’s more the idea of how I was slighted that annoys me in a sort of cold blooded rational way. Someone broke into my car about a week ago looking for shit to steal and my reaction was just “well…that sucks, guess I need to get my window fixed now. At least they broke the small window”. It’s annoying that it will cost me a bit of money, and they took a jacket and pair of sunglasses I liked, but to me it’s not something that is going to ruin my day. Shit happens, whatever. My aunt told me that my cousin once asked “does brandon ever get angry?” and I realized that I really don’t think my family has ever seen me actually angry. They’ve seen me annoyed, or in a mood where I might be rude or unpleasant to be around..but not actually angry. Shit just rolls off me usually. I really get upset more at things that are just incredibly stupid and illogical which hamper my freedom for no goddamned sensible reason at all, or incredible stupidity in general, and then I tend to just rant and mock the stupidity of it until I get bored of talking and move onto something else.
“ENTPs know how to diffuse emotional and physical violence by being completely other to it, like in some alternate cartoon dimension to it that makes you look so completely ridiculous when you address them in this way, which you probably wouldn’t even have the desire to in the first place. They just don’t attract that sort of thing to themselves.”
This is really spot on. It wasn’t really until I got into mbti and started kind of comparing my experience with life to others that I realized how different my experience of relating to people and being alive so far has been. I was maybe not as popular as I’d have liked, but at the worst I’d maybe experience people not preferring my company/personality or being neutral to me, but I never seemed to really piss anyone off or draw negative attention to myself even if I never held back my opinions and actually spoke up frequently with mockery towards certain opinions or ideals others held.
I’m really not sure what it is, but there definitely seems to be something about our irreverent way that lets us get away with shit that others would be lambasted for. I think maybe part of it is that people see us pretty easily for what we are and what we’re about and something about that is disarming and engenders some kind of …….idk, something.
Yes, exactly. Thanks for sharing.
again, amazingly accurate (and, of course, flattering: thanks for liking us :))
I frequently wonder why people tend to like me, although I know I can come across as an inconsiderate and provocative son of a bitch sometimes … when I was teenager, I remember my friends were frequently afraid I’d get my ass kicked, but I never did (ok, just once … at it was a premeditated assault, not anything I’d provoke … and to be honest, although I lost a tooth and got two others damaged, I found it quite amusing and even liberating: now I know that being beaten up is really not such a big deal, one shouldn’t be too afraid of being physically hurt).
so, I also like to think that people see that under this provocative attire, we’re really well meaning people. However, there clearly are some J types that hate my guts … but since I don’t ever hate them back, they usually end up rationalizing my behavior and cope with it. I’d be long dead without those Fe faculties, though 🙂
Yeah, Fe in ENTP = an amazing ability to talk their way out of difficult situations. And its hard to feel ill will towards an ENTP for longer than, say, 5 minutes. Even if they burnt the whole town down.
ENTPs just need to see what happens when x, y, or z is put into play. But, there really is no malice or evil intent in their behavior. And sometimes they come up with some really nifty shit. The general rule is that the farther out you let an ENTP extend, the more benevolent their behaviors appear.
Of course in the near-term sense of ENTPs living in their mother’s coddling care, they appear like Tasmanian devils from hell. The farther out they extend into the social-economic system, the more valuable their behavior becomes.
But, god forbid if an ENTP male is born to an introverted feeling type mother. She is gonna be in for a time.
btw, for me, Paul Feyerabend is The ENTP philosopher / science theorist
(it has nothing to do with your response, I was thinking of the article 🙂 )
Yes, I totally agree. He reminds me of Robert Anton Wilson in some key ways.
I’m an ENTP with two ENTJ parents and let me tell you, this is the most accurate shit.
I am quite in love with this ENTP though he’s halfway round the world. It’s hard to imagine that someone like him exists really. Or I don’t know maybe I’m putting him on a pedestal. But my God is he strange and hilarious. That Fe too, it’s very disarming.. They can be quite the gentlemen I think. And he’s just cute to boot. Sometimes he can also project that warm fuzzy feeling.. Although I don’t know if he’s pretending it. If you write an article and INFJs I def will donate. Developed ENTPs are just all round wonderful.. Like a unicorn.
I’ve found most of your articles incredibly insightful, and in one or two you’ve knocked me off my “throne of all knowing” of thinking there are certain patterns in the world only I had thus far figured out (yeah, INFJ here). Surprised enough I had to binge read this entire website this weekend.
I have mostly praises to sing and you need not convince me of your insight into MBTI. However I must question some of your debunked celebrity typings. Einstein ENTP? I can’t think of a more clear example in any person of the play between dominant Ti and inferior Fe. His genius was stripping down the laws of the universe to its most basic fundamentals, classic reductionalist Ti, and his inferior Fe love/hate (but mostly love) relationship with fame, and his deep desire for harmony and peace with humanity despite the lack of harmony and emotional depth in his own personal life. If you’re going to attempt to debunk an MBTI label as universally agreed upon as Einstein, that is going to need a more thorough explanation than “because neener neener, I’m right and you’re wrong.” It waters down the integrity of otherwise solid insight in your posts.
“His genius was stripping down the laws of the universe to its most basic fundamentals, classic reductionalist Ti…”
Yes, exactly, and that is the gift of the ENTP type via their auxiliary Ti. INTPs would do the opposite. They look at the stripped down formulations and build out from there. Much of the current math-driven physics is an INTP thing. Einstein was not a reductionist thinker. He used reductionist methods (as all physicists do) as proofs of the primary aspects of reality he was visualizing.
It is also pretty obvious just from looking at Einstein’s popular mythology as “the absent-minded professor” that he had inferior sensation, in this case, introverted sensation. His Fe operated much more like a tertiary function, especially as the way you just described it. Emotional depth is a thing of Fi. Both INTPs and ENTPs have weak Fi.
To me it is just obvious that Einstein is an ENTP and not an INTP. He is the classical portrait of the space cadet and irreverent ENTP type. It is also obvious (to me) that he is pulling from a place of dominant perception.
One of the ways to tell these two types apart is that ENTPs simplify in elegant and tight formulations (and irreverently and flippantly sometimes), vast panoramas and tracts of perceptual reality. INTPs expand upon these formulations (often mathematical) to build up the world again out of math. Which is why they make such great computer programmers for one thing. In essence, INTPs think much the way a computer does. And a computer won’t accept anything as real if it doesn’t add up. If 2 + 2 = 4 all the time, then that is a basis for according reality to some entity. This isn’t true much of the time except in mathematical language. Or in hard sciences (which have math as a proving ground). Einstein was not a person that was at all oriented by math as a primary point-of-view. He was a visionary, a dreamer of what lay behind certain observable physical phenomena. This is an Ne orientation, not a Ti one.
No INTP would ever say this in earnest: “As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain, and as far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality.”
Einstein said that. Math is the primary reality of INTPs in one way or another. So, to say this is basically threatening their whole reality orientation. ENTPs, on the other hand, mostly use and view math in a very playful and fun way. They don’t take it that seriously. This is true with auxiliary functions in all types. Dominant function = very serious, auxiliary function = luxury function. The auxiliary function doesn’t have to operate at all, and many times it doesn’t. Which doesn’t mean it shouldn’t. But, ENTPs simply do not take math that seriously. Or much of anything.
Now watch INTPs have a blast recreating reality via computers as every movie made by Pixar does (or most every movie at least). That’s the INTPs having an irreverent blast with their auxiliary Ne driven by Ti formulations. ENTPs are more into explaining reality with math and closed systems language. INTPs are more into recreating reality with math. Which is why they are having such a fun time nowadays with all the CGI in movies and digitalized animations and so on that has taken over the entertainment industry.
I hope that clears some stuff up. If not, well, it’s just my opinion. Take it for what it is.
Blake,
I just read this for the first time. Einstein as anything other than an ENTP has never made sense to me. He seems a perfect example of an ENTP who does not waver from the big and expansive who supports his curiosity for understanding it with well honed Ti. Possibility of the nature of the universe considerations are primary and the tools to refine and define these are next, so Ne-Ti seems to be exhibited in all its infinite fineness in Einstein.
Good article but you typed a lot of ppl wrong. Taylor is esfp. Bowie is isfp. Cowell is istp.
Yeah, I might have typed some of them wrong but how would we know? Actually, now that I think about it Liz Taylor probaly wasn’t an ENTJ but she is the epitome of an type 3 on enneagram. And she was a heartbreaker, which does come from the type 3 position on enneagram. I could see her as an ENFP. I don’t know, maybe she was an ESFP. The thing about her is that she had a pretty good sense of humor and awareness about herself similar to Marilyn Monroe. Marilyn Monroe was a raving beauty but also something of a goofball and comedian. I would type Marilyn as an ENFP, but I suppose either of them could have been ESFP. But, neither of them seemed particularly down-to-earth. Anyway, you might be right about Taylor. I certainly do not feel very strongly about it.
But, Bowie I’m pretty sure fits the mold of a enneatype 3 ENTJ. ISFP would be the opposite type to ENTJ and if I had to choose between those either/or choices, I would side with ENTJ. Bowie was very savvy and calculated in his artistic career. He was an operator. He was an assimilator of what was going on in his environment art-wise and rode these trends expertly. Not an introverted type consciousness. I see Te as a dominant reference point with Ni projection, which could mean glam rock. There is something very glamorous about enneatype 3. The ENTJs here are harsh but softened considerably by the Venusian implications of this enneatype. I simply do not see any introverted feeling in Bowie. He was pretty much the antithesis of a deeply feeling artist.
Cowell an ISTP? Maybe. However I see the harshness in him that only TeNi can bring. But, I suppose it is possible that he could be an ISTP. Not feeling that strongly about it either way. Also, ENTJs and ISTPs can resemble each other in their highest manifestations.
Hi Blake- It happened again. I typed another ENTJ in my world and it has led me to wonder… well, what the deal is with them and me. I’m INFJ and over the course of my life I have met, known, and loved quite a few ENTJ’s. I’ll admit- I like them. Probably attracted to the TE- not sure what it is. And you know what- they like me back. Why? I have no idea. I do have nice dimples… but I think it’s deeper than that (I’m guessing my crazy Ni). Would you consider expanding on how different personalities react to each other? Such as ENTJ and INFJ? In a different article about the interaction between INFP and INFJ you hit the nail on the head about their interactions. Most mbti articles seem to focus on explaining the individual and not the chemistry between personalities. Thanks for considering and I love your articles.
Yes, I would like to explore type interactions. But, you understand this necessarily multiplies the amount of writing I would have to do. There are 16 types. But, to write about each of those types interactions with every other type would be 16 x 16.
Briefly, INFJs look up to ENTJs and ENTJs look down on them. It is a supervisor/supervised relationship. How that works out depends on how willing the INFJ is to accept orders and direction from an ENTJ and whether the ENTJ considers the INFJ worthy enough to take an interest in. ENTJs are the natural father figures to INFJs. How does the INFJ experience the father archetype? What was the INFJs natural biological father like? There are extenuating factors. But, in theory, that is the natural interaction between the two. The ENTJ may be a disinterested father or for some reason find the INFJ to be worthwhile to invest energy into, to take a deeper interest.
In general it is an unequal relationship with the ENTJ calling the shots. Which suits them just fine. INFJs are generally willing to allow the ENTJ to be master. Unless, for some reason, they have a need to rebel against the father/authority etc.
Hi Blake. What aspect of this dynamic makes you describe ENTJs as “the natural father figures to INFJs?” My birth father is ENTJ. He is the tyrannical narcissistic figure you’ve described and for the first few decades of my life, I played into his very unhealthy setup. As soon as I stood up for myself, our entire relationship was over. But when I was young, of the siblings, I was the only one willing to “befriend” and look up to him. I’m curious what it is about the INFJ – ENTJ dynamic that would have promoted that.
I got this idea from Socionics which is an offshoot of Jungian Psychology types with a slightly different bent than Myers-Briggs. Anyhow, one of the things that Socionics does is in addition to labeling and describing each of the 16 types, they also label and provide descriptions for each possible relationship between types. In that system, the ENTJ/INFJ relationship is called a Relation of Supervision with the ENTJ being the Supervisor and the INFJ being the Supervisee (the one who is supervised). Relations of Supervision are one of two relations with unequal roles. The other 14 intertype relationships of Socionics are all equal.
Here is a link to one Socionics site that describes the character of Relations of Supervision.
I simply interpreted this type of relationship to be a father/child relationship. It’s similar, but, I feel calling the supervisor the natural father of a type to be more accurate and interesting in some way.
Also, the primary function of the natural father or supervisor of any type is what I call the superego function. It is well-known that the superego has a patriarchal character to it. One could also call it the critical parent, which I have seen assigned to the opposite function (id function by my lights).
Or perhaps, the best way to call this relation is a relation of authority. Fathers are the first and natural authorities in a child’s life and so later are supervisors and bosses and teachers and what have you.
This relationship doesn’t mean that you will have easy relations with this authority/father/supervisor but rather means that is the natural dynamic operant between the two types.
So, INFJs are in a natural position of subservience to the ENTJ type. But, they may just as easily rebel against their father as respect and listen to his advice. The INFJ can easily feel resentful at the ENTJ because they feel beneath them or controlled by them or not appropriately valued by them etc. But, there is a tendency for the INFJ to want the respect of the ENTJ and also to have something to prove to them, especially if the ENTJ is a man and the INFJ is so as well. And especially if the ENTJ is the actual father of the INFJ boy.
Um, an excellent portrayal of this ENTJ-INFJ dynamic is seen in the movie Finding Forrester with Sean Connery as an elder male ENTJ and the young main protagonist (an aspiring writer) is an INFJ. It’s a very touching movie about the relationship between these two, which starts out difficultly and then proceeds over time to mutual trust such that the INFJ character (Jamal Wallace) slowly allows the ENTJ to tutor him and take him under his wing. But, it is a relationship of inequality because the ENTJ is the natural authority in the situation. This can either be developed in a positive way (like in this movie) or it could be developed in a negative way by the INFJ hating and refuting the father. That happens too. You know, Freudian psychology and all.
O, you could also look to the latest installment of Star Wars with the Darth Vader/Kylo Ren relationship. Kylo Ren is a dark INFJ character that looks up to and takes inspiration from the fallen Darth Vader. He worships at the alter of Darth Vader, so to speak.
So, hope that clarifies.
Blake, thanks very much for the detailed answer. Even though it resonates in my (n=1) personal experience, I didn’t find that site to note INFJ-ENTJ as supervisee-supervisor relations. If I’m reading it correctly, they are noting relations of semi-duality instead:
http://www.socionics.com/rel/relcht.htm
(I like using the calculator on the middle of this page: http://www.socionics.com/rel/rel.htm)
O yeah, I forgot that detail about the system. Socionics does not assign the J/P preference of a dominant introverted type by their extraverted auxiliary function, hence an INFJ in the Myers-Briggs system would be an INFP in the Socionics system because Socionics would consider a type that has dominant introverted intuition to be a P type. INFPs in this system are labelled as INFJs. Yes, that’s confusing, but the function stackings are all the same between systems, it’s just the type codes that change for introverts. Extraverts stay the same because they are already labelled in Myers-Briggs according to their dominant functions on the J/P preference.
So, to be clear the INFJ-ENTJ in the Myers-Briggs system is one of Relations of Supervision in the Socionics system, it’s just the INFJ of Myers-Briggs is called the INFP in Socionics. Actually, Socionics really calls the INFJ of Myers-Briggs an IEI according to their original type code. IEI stands for an Introverted Intuitive with Ethics (I think) whereas, an INTJ of the Myers-Briggs system would be labelled an ILI, Introverted Intuitive with Logic. See the pattern?
Thanks for the explanation. It turned out to be pretty accurate for me as INFp for the ENTj relationship, but didn’t hold well for others (e.g., I consistently match their INFj-ENFp description of Mirror Relations pretty well versus INFp-ENFp Contrary Relations not at all). There was an article (with some debate in the comments) on there saying you can’t always directly cross the introverted types from MBTI to Socionics as they could land as p or j. I guess that’s holding true in my case.
Seen the new Star Wars? Profound affect on me. Particularly Kylo’s coming. Beautiful painful things.
Not yet, but soon.
Hey Blake,
Are you an ENTP? Have you had bad personal experiences with ENTJs? Were you perhaps bullied by an ENTJ?
I just wanted to tell you some of your points about ENTJ’s and ENTP’s are way off. First of all – to assume their is such thing as ‘an asshole type’ completely undermines the complexity of the MBTI. Also, as an ENTP, I’ve had fits of white rage and had to have anger management when I was a teenager. I have had plenty of situations though where the ‘how to diffuse emotional and physical violence by being completely other to it’ technique was used – but this was more survival than anything else. Like one time, a guy from my neighbourhood tried to rob me – and I just said ‘Really, man? Like you’re really going to do this? Even though I know which area you’re from, which places you hang out in?’ completely fearless of the consequences – maybe excited by the possibility of something different happening. But when I perceive that I am able to win, and dominate, I do so and instinctively. It’s intuitive. It’s not related to my personality, but something deeper – instinct. A basic function stemming from our reptilian brain. Personality is more linked to our mammalian brain.
I guess my point is – don’t underestimate the complexity of human psychology. These types are not written in stone, and neither are the behaviours they encompass. ENTJ’s aren’t all assholes, and not all ENTP’s are comedians. Though I’m usually considered a funny guy, I’m also considered a giant dick by many.
And since you seem to be into such rigid typing and generalisations – ‘No one has ever got the best of an ENTP.’ is absolute horse shit.
“Are you an ENTP?”
Tee hee hee.
“Have you had bad personal experiences with ENTJs?”
Yes, of course. Who hasn’t?
“Were you perhaps bullied by an ENTJ?”
I wouldn’t go that far. Is ass rape bullying?
“I guess my point is – don’t underestimate the complexity of human psychology. These types are not written in stone”
I don’t underestimate the complexity of human psychology. However, I also don’t underestimate the simplicity of it either. This shit can be rather simple. Refreshingly so.
“ENTJ’s aren’t all assholes”
Yes they are. That is one of the keys to accurate identification of them.
“and not all ENTP’s are comedians.”
That’s not what Socrates said. And it is written in stone somewhere. By Plato of course.
“And since you seem to be into such rigid typing and generalisations – ‘No one has ever got the best of an ENTP.’ is absolute horse shit.”
I’d say its more like approximate horse shit. Let’s not go making such extreme statements. Like I do.
Yes, you’re right, probaly someone somewhere has gotten the best of an ENTP. Maybe god did once or twice. And as I said, the body politic of Athens got the best of that most famous of all ENTPs. But, did they really? Death is just a slight inconvenience to an ENTP. Are they really even here in the first place?
And so on and so forth.
I’m surprised you didn’t discuss the enneagram variations for the ENTP because it does make a difference.
My pet ENTP is an enneagram 8 which means he’s a bit more intense than the average. Plus he seems to aspire to be a ENTJ or ESTP or something. He’s a power lifter and has an aggressive streak that is as you say cartoonish…. though he could definitely beat someone up if he was inclined to. He’s great at pissing people off, though only people he wants, which is a lot…. he doesn’t care for most people, quite judgemental to be honest. I think that could be the enneagram 8 showing through if people aren’t important he has no problem messing with them to make himself feel superior, or as he would say he is superior. It’s hilarious though now that I’ve gotten over myself and don’t care when he offends people, probably cause if they are stupid enough to be offended they deserve it. He can get away with practically anything it’s amazing, taught me how to use my Fe in-conjunction with me Ti better, how to have fun with it.
I highly recommend all INFJ’s getting ENTP pets. Gets you over over sensitivity quickly and they make your life fun.
Give me a famous example of who you think is an ENTP at type 8. Give me three example if you can. I’ll see if we are on the same page attribution-wise.
Uhm no… that’s not “a variation” of a type 8, that’s an UNHEALTHY type 8!
You are also unhealthy, that much is obvious.
Just FYI since you’re apparently oblivious to it.
I’m an ENTP..as I spoke with my buddy the other day..I always identified him to be like me..he told be he was put away as a teen..anger issues..but he has been pulling entp on all test..but kind it sounds like you’re an ENTP..simply..oh nevermind..tell me I’m wrong lol..I was also curious to the different entp types of the enneagram to be honest..I’m not much into the enneagram..but this post just had me pause and read for about an hour or so 🙂 but I suppose I’m a 7w8..but I pulled a few possible 8w7 results..I notice the similarities to myself in both..but I was made disabled less than a year and a half ago..I read everyday instead of working and barely sleeping and seeing family..I take kid to school everyday and love it more than all the money claimed I made..I did well..an entrepreneurial type since a teen..super independent still..but now I also with just recently had my first ever non ENTP type..and not sure how accurate the results..but I popped an INTP..results were giving excellent internal skills..with of course the ENTP next option ENFP after..so..basically..I’m not sure my enneagram as I have only gotta into that this year. .but..back to talking about great ol me lol..I say I’m stronger now than before..and prior I was basically superman..a tractor trailer ran me over..the police said they heard a half block away indoors and thought it was an explosion..I got out..they said I was really lucky..I laughed at first..saying I’m indestructible..that truck hit like a …….. but most folks now see my struggle and say I have no idea how you do it..i still feel like the king of the jungle..and I will never lose..”I’m not a smart man..that’s just all I know (right now) 1 mind really can change the world..will it be you..success..what does it mean to you..trust the process” much continued success to you on your journey
@ENTPType8w7 Yep, he’s pretty much clueless of how childish he can be. Sounds like a pissed off teen whining about life or something. He seems to be evading your insight, which probably means you’re right.
“But, god forbid if an ENTP male is born to an introverted feeling type mother. She is gonna be in for a time.”
Or marries one. What was she thinking ? Oh right, she wasn’t.
Haha! Funny.
I must have won the ENTJ lottery – twice. The two ENTJs in my life are not only extremely protective of me, but they are both very even-handed people, and I greatly enjoy their bluntness in most cases. After seven years of practice with them, I can stand toe-to-toe with the two that I know in an argument, and even win now and then.
My old boss (who is now a very good friend of mine), hired a bunch of misfits with potential and enjoyed challenging himself by cultivating their potential. He laid out clear paths for promotions, provided us with set raises as incentive, free training courses (using his own spare time – he taught them), and a library of resources of what were otherwise expensive books. I worked with him at three different companies, and sometimes he did things I didn’t agree with. There were times when I told him that I thought he treated some people unfairly, which we never saw eye-to-eye on, but we talked often about things.
I was on his bad side once, and this stern “I will end your employment”-ness that he approached me with actually extremely impressed me. First off, I really truly deserved what he said to me, I had f!%ked up pretty royal on this occasion, and I knew that before he even brought me aside to speak with me. (Oh, that is another thing, he never disciplined us in front of our co-workers, it was always a very private chat.) I was thoroughly impressed that he was able to set aside his feelings for me and treat me the same as any of his other employees. I really hate receiving special treatment.
I followed him to two different companies, and I recommended him for CTO of another company I went to – which he end up getting, and made me feel incredibly happy that I could finally do something in return for him. We always bounced ideas off of each other, and he was always pushing me to go further with my career—that is still one of his and my wife’s biggest frustrations with me, they think much more highly of me than I do of myself.
He was absolutely an enneagram type 8, but the growth path of type 8 is towards type 2 and he was very much in that growth state.
As far as my wife goes (also an ENTJ), we have butted heads on sooo many occasions, and at first, it was paralyzing for me, I couldn’t handle her intensity. She was driven to reach conclusions by talking things out, and those conclusions had to be reached ASAP. Which, as an INFJ (I hate saying that.. -.-), was very difficult for me. I won’t lie, there were a few times when I locked myself in the bathroom and cried, but she was in a bad state back then, and so was I. We eventually found a middle ground in the way that we communicate, and we haven’t had issues since then. She never said anything mean to me, she just made me feel completely overwhelmed via her stance and aura of anger.
I’ve known her since we were kids though, and that fiery passion in her eyes was what got me hooked on her in the first place. We had a very on and off relationship for several times before we finally got married. She finally found the cure for melting my defense lock-down mode. Letting herself cool down and just hugging me totally melted me and helped me open up and express myself.
I’ve also watched “Hell’s Kitchen” with Mr. Gordon Ramsay, and I have to say, that show only presents one aspect of him. He gets very angry because the people on that show are supposed to be trained professionals, yet they break down, serve raw meats (which gets him incredibly angry because he is concerned for the welfare of his customers – I totally get that), they get passive-aggressive with each other and fail to put out the quality of food which he expects of them. I disagree with the way that he handles things, I feel like he causes a bit of a feedback loop with his negativity at times, but I understand why he feels the way he does.
If you watch some other shows he is a part of, you can see how much he cares about helping people.
I really think you should have another look at ENTJ’s at some point, they do a lot for people and can really be amazing friends / lovers.
Just because I call ENTJs cocksucking motherfuckers doesn’t mean I don’t like them. Somebody has to maintain quality control.
I tell you, one thing I truly admire and respect about ENTJs is that they won’t tolerate mediocrity.
Gordon Ramsey is a good example of this. I’m sure he is a lot nicer on a more personal level. As a matter of fact, I know he is. I’ve seen him in interviews and he is a lot more personable. Just don’t fuck up on their watch. Which was what I was alluding to in this article. If you ain’t in their employ, they’ll mostly leave you alone. But, if you are on their ship, better have your shit together.
Sorry for being presumptuous. I suppose I got a little defensive there and didn’t pick up on that.
Lol, that was a hilarious response though. =) Thank you again for your efforts!
Don’t fuck with an ENTP in love.
If you cause problems to the most dearest and closely held relationship to this type.
Your life is over.
True, or just the inner circle.Don’t do that.We don’t like people hurting the few people we deem worthy to be considered close friends/partners.
And we are very creative.Luckily, if people show remorse, we’re not good at hanging on to anger.Takes too much energy.
Yup yup ENTP7w8
Interesting read. I am an ENTJ and my husband is an ENTP, and somehow we get along very well. It might help that I am organized but not a clean freak, so when he misplaces things I can help him find them.
Maybe I’m on the lower spectrum though, because I don’t consider myself to be an uncaring person, or maybe the type you discussed is an extreme of that personality.
I am not an emotional person though, and I have a difficult time knowing what to do when people are emotional around me.
I corresponded with an ENTJ to see what he thought of something. He gave me all of this great insight and advice, but the best thing I took away was that he said he got the vibe that I was “impressionable.” I thought this was interesting. It made me wonder if my ENTJ friend (a different ENTJ) also gets this “vibe” with me. I asked my husband if he thought that word could be used to describe me, and he said, “You’re basically the opposite of impressionable.”
Ah, perspectives….how I love them. 🙂
When I look at an ENTJ, I read: wants to be the expert, respects other experts, and, deeper, does not want to be seen as not smart enough. So, I approach in a way to let them know I celebrate their expertise. And it’s not disingenuous because I really do appreciate it. God knows I’ll never have THAT KIND of intellectual stamina.
It’s just that they don’t see that I’m much more interested in the perspective of the expert than I am in his/her expertise.
Content = secondary concern, Perspective = primary concern.
Content = tool, Perspective = goal.
I admire the intellectual breadth. Don’t seem to be originators too much, but definitely badass at compiling, analyzing, organizing, and then explaining in a digestible summarization. Substantiated facts and ideas are cool and everything, but (for me) not half as fun as the stuff I prefer to play around in. Still, I have reverence for their gift. I just wish it didn’t have to be that they are blind to mine. (No, they are not totally blind to it, but, as the other ENTJ told me, immature ENTJs won’t put it on the same playing field with their own.) Oh, well. Let them think I’m impressionable. Maybe I am. I think their strengths are important in the big picture, and I appreciate how my ENTJ friend has pushed me and encouraged me. I also like the “go-go-go” experience when I’m hanging out with him. I collapse at the end of the day, but it’s exhilarating while it lasts.
Do you think Donald Trump is an ENTJ?
I think auxiliary Ni explains a lot about his campaign. He seemed to be tapping into some collective-unconsciousness shit right from the start. He doesn’t talk like other politicians talk. He isn’t trying to communicate ideas. He uses his words like he’s hammering a gong to provoke a sympathetic resonance. He delivers simple, essential, ultimate statements and repeats them three or four times, to strengthen and clarify the vibration.
He doesn’t say much that’s specific, definite or complex. Instead, he delivers the potent seed of an image or idea which people already have to some degree, and then they fill it in for themselves. His attitude is “You and I both know what’s going on here. ” He points to conspiracies behind everything. And everything he says is open to infinite interpretation and re-interpretation. Everything he says can shift and change.
Yes, Trump could definitely be an ENTJ. Good commentary.
ENTJ’s will never put ENTPs in whatever the ENTJ loosely perceives and “their place”. We will dance around them gleefully and drive them mad. Been there, done that, not interested in the T-shirt. 😉
Thanks for this. I’m an ENTP with an ENTJ boss who’s driving me crazy… Tears of frustration turned into giggles. Thank you!
Welcome 🙂
“ENTPs get away with being insensitive because they are so funny.”
I enjoy this gift every day (well, most days with my ENTP).
ENTPs in my opinion seem to be completely amused and dismissive of power, authority, social hierarchies and will enter into such things with complete irreverence and say things others wouldn’t dare (or if they did, it would be the end of them). Somehow they do this with impunity and garner lots of affection from others along the way. I’ve watched mine look like a clueless socially inept ass, who magically turns everything upside down and makes people first bristle, go silent, and then laugh. How do they do this? They are intellectually promiscuous and adaptable to challenge, which they seem to turn to their favor and leave others scratching their heads and laughing or at least not pummeling them, as at first seemed the most likely outcome.
This is way off. Entjs don’t scream at people in rage. They’re organized, efficient, and they’re argumentative. They’re not raging at people in anger. They’re rigid in arguing but that does not mean they scream in everyone’s faces’. They’re just strong willed, self-confident, and a little arrogant, stubborn, and dominant. Only extremely extremely extremely unhealthy Estjs act this way. Estj’s are cops however Entj’s are leaders. This is about extremely extremely extremely unhealthy estjs. Thats’s all i CAN SAY.
Nah, I don’t agree BGOG, I think you’re mixing up the violence of an appointed ruler (cop) with the violence of an un-preventable ruler (ENTJ). Sure entjs do scream in people’s faces. When nothing else works, it’s like, the only little bit of legal and socially non-toxic violence we have at our disposal. It’s not even slightly untrue to say that most important things in the world have demanded a little violence.
If the world was different I wouldn’t ever scream in anyone’s face. I would always be nice, and I would make sure they knew they had been appreciated and that regardless of current circumstances, this isn’t personal…
(Lever, Trap door, slide to wherever it is they wanted to be anyway but didn’t know it yet)
If it’s true that there are important things to be done, and if it’s true that a person in my reach can make those things more likely to happen or less likely to happen depending on how they act, and if it’s kind of only meaningful being Alive if I’m getting important things to happen (and no my kids growing up like the 100 billion before them doesn’t count), well, it’s definitely for sure 100% no problem for me or you or a few others to get screamed at here and there, or trap doored by people who know better than we do what needs to happen.
Cops screaming is probably different. I can’t imagine an entj becoming a cop because it seems so powerless, so maybe that’s why they scream so much. And always call for backup. Actually, no. I’ve met powerful cops. They are chill as fuck. Powerful people are only freaky when they aren’t in power. And unpowerful people are freaky when they are in power. Maybe.
And sorry for veering off topic and being pretty unclear, BGOG. I guess I was saying, seems short sighted to say that cops=screaming=Unhealthy-sensors. I don’t think that those three things are very related.
How would you describe a type 3 ENTP?
As mistyped either eneagrammatically or Myers-Briggs-wise. In other words, I don’t think there is any such thing as a type 3 ENTP. Unless, you can provide some compelling famous examples of such to change my mind.
All ENTPs that I recognize as such would be type 7 on enneagram.
Myers-Briggs types that could by enneagram type 3 (and possibly confused with ENTP) are ESTP, ENFP, and ENFJ. Those are the primary types I recognize at enneatype 3. It’s possible there are ESFPs and ISFPs at this enneapoint too, but, I’m unsure at this time to commit to any except the three MB types listed above.
I rescinded the type 3 ENTJ as a possibility in my INTJ vs. ENTJarticle.
I don’t feel an ENTP can be described from a type 3 perspective.
Not sure I agree with this stance on the relationship between enneagram and MBTI. I see that there should be some overlap somewhere, there must be. And as such, there might be some natural correlation between the 16 types and the enneagram types. (For example, it would seem INTJ and type 5 might be a more common pairing). But enneagram and MBTI are two different systems built from different perspectives on human behavior. MBTI is about cognition, while enneagram is about motivation. The enneagram was developed with the theory that our ruling motivations develop out of childhood experiences, whereas the MBTI takes a more “from-birth” stance (nuture vs nature).
I’ve seen you say that you’re not convinced that an INFP type 4 can exist but I’m absolutely sure of my functions (Fi-Ne) and reading the type 4 descriptors were the truest things I’ve ever read about myself. I think enneagram and MBTI have correlations, but in the end enneagram is about motive and MBTI is about preferences of cognition. As a result, MBTI descriptions tend to be more neutral leaning positive whereas enneagram type descriptors tend to be more revealing and leaning negative.
It might be hard for me to imagine how it would present in some cases, but I think any Myers Briggs type can fall anywhere on the enneagram. I agree that some types appear to overlap very closely with certain enneagram types more than others, though.
Yes in theory there must be (is) a certain connection (vs. statistical correlation) between Myers-Briggs and Enneagram types. But 1) neither of the systems can fully/comprehensively model the psyche/personality of an individual, and 2) there unknown elements behind personalities that push the personality of an individual to a state where neither of the certain connections do not exist. Because of these, it should not be surprising/impossible to see, for example, any of the 16 Types as Type 3.
An ENTJ Type 3, in my view, would plan their success (Ni) based on the expectations of the society (probably Se-related) and do wherever s/he can to “achieve” those things that are highly valued by the society (Te).
An ENTP Type 3, again in my view, would observe the society and formulate an ultimate success or achievement over time (Ne) and s/he will keep changing their plans. They probably resort to knowledge and books and outside sources to find meaning of life and again, they will formulate the ultimate success as they go. They don’t want to be successful so everyone respects them and sucks their dicks (as ENTJs would do). They want to secure love from people (Fe). I have found many of the true mentors and motivational speakers to be ENTP Type 3. They are indeed rare. They go to the same stage comedian ENTPs go, but with a brain that has something to give to people. Something that people can actually use in their lives. They are also very good professors and teachers, the ones who have spent many hours to learn something, and teach it in two minutes.
I believe that Tai Lopez (everyone thinks he is a scam) is an ENTP Type 3.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KlROa95m7EE
So, in short, I think although the theme of Type 3 is success and achievement, the context is different for each of the 16 Types.
Loves,
Jay
Less harsh type of entj…
Anyone seen Chelsea Handler. Is she an example of milder entj?
Blake,
You are my favorite thing on the internet in quite some time.
Got especially excited when the convo almost went towards ENTP 8… and then it dissipated. I identify as such. You asked the prompter for 3 famous examples… do you have these? Sounds like you think all ENTP are 7s… here to contest that, in typical challenger form. Just starting to explore your site. Perhaps I’ll find further elaborations on ENTP 8 somewhere here… (If they exist??…If I exist???). I suppose if you disagree, it will just make me feel that more special.
Your thoughts?? Indulge me please??
Grateful for your insight and existence,
Colleen
Sounds like you think all ENTP are 7s…
Yes, I think all ENTPs are Type 7 on the enneagram. I’m not aware of an ENTP I’d consider enneatype 8, however, I’m open to considering compelling testimony in that regard.
Actually, now that I think about it, Robert Anton Wilson seems like he could be such a case. He seems like some cross between ENTP and ENTJ. I can never quite resolve him to one or the other. And all ENTJs are Type 8 on enneagram to me now (no type 3 or type 7 anymore). So, maybe Robert Anton Wilson is an E8 ENTP. Besides him though, who else?
You are my favorite thing on the internet in quite some time.
Yes, I can’t help but agree with you on that 😉
Thanks!
Based on research more than knowing, see the following for your consideration:
Teddy Roosevelt
Che Guevara
Lucille Ball
I’ve seen all of them and I wouldn’t consider any of them ENTPs. Not even remotely.
Teddy and Che I’d consider enneatype 8’s. Che is definitely an enneatype 8 ENFJ. Teddy is probaly an ENTJ.
Lucille is definitely not a type 8 or an ENTP. I don’t know how you see either for her.
So…
Colleen! You got some splainin to do!
This post is awesome and hilarious! I don’t really believe in this shit but we took the tests years ago at work and it says I’m an ENTP and my wife is an ENTJ. I never really knew what that meant but for years I’ve been telling her there are good ENTJs and bad ENTJs and she should try to be the good kind. She often accuses me of being an asshole because I think everything is funny and especially her bizarre antics and she starts some B.S. argument about nonsense and eventually accuses me of playing mind games with her. So basically she’s a bitch but I’m great at fucking with her and that’s why we’ve been married for over 15 years with two very happy children. Somehow our children just love life and our household and have no idea how hard it is to be married to an ENTJ.
This article very masterfully stroked my ENTP ego. Loved it.
Good, and I need crack, so let this ego-stroking manifest itself into some cashola pouring down into my piggybank.
Because I got all reindeer on red alert!